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Occupational Medical Assessment Was what I experienced the norm?

#1 User is offline   aphinity 

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  Posted 21 September 2004 - 01:42 AM

Just wondering if anyone can tell me the normal procedure "or what is the norm" during an Occupational Medical Assessment appointment I recently attended.

I really became quite uncomfortable during this.

I am an early 30's woman with an undiagnosed injury to my lower back, nothing nasty showing up in MRI's etc, but terrible terrible pain in back and leg. Injured myself earlier this year, and due to the condition I am in find sitting and standing for longer than 15 mins excruciating and impossible to bear, and have been off work.


I was to attend a medical assessment advised by ACC.

Please tell me, is it normal to not be told what to expect when inquiring to ACC about the nature of the visit? Ananswered questions like How long do these take, what will be happening...the usual things I wanted to know.

Is it normal, to be told to remove your clothing to your underwear, with no change cublicle or privacy to undress, no "gown" to put over you, no "nurse", NO Warning of a physical exam where inner cheek buttocks examined, asked to squat in your undies in front of a repulsive OVERWEIGHT creepy "doctor", turn and bend over and suchlike?????

Boy, I felt so degraded, the pain of all this movement was immense...the travel alone to get there was an hour which didn't help matters...... even more, I had my boyfriend there as support, but it was awful doing all this in front of him.

I was not prepared for all this, let alone for an "up close & personal" inspection.

I choose my own doctor by how comfortable they make me feel, and if happy, am ok about undergoing the usual physicals that make up a womans life at the docs.

I was not comfortable with this man from the minute I stepped into his office.

I hated the way he looked at me..... eeewwwww if you know what I mean.
I want to complain, but do not know who to..

I really feel degraded, humiliated, and to make matters worse, the pain I have is "all in my head". My chiro chuckled at this comment.

I don't know what to do, or even if my rights have been abused here.

Please help..... and please tell me if I have

This assessor, is also, I have found, on the Not Nice list of ACC names on this site.

If you can help me, or wish to discuss by email, please let me know. I would so appreciate opinions on this. It was demoralising, and to me, downright rude.
I had more respect shown during childbirth.

Cheers, and "awesome" site here...thank you for its help already.

A
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#2 User is offline   jocko 

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Posted 21 September 2004 - 09:37 AM

My sympathies are with you Aphinity. It is a degrading and humiliating process where your rights are trampled in the dust. That is its purpose as well as providing a means for the corporation to exit you. These things are a farce and an afront to human dignity. I recall Lianne Dalziel telling us at a SPAV meeting that these assessors were brought in to ensure their "Independence." So typical of her blatant lies. Hang in mate. Don't be frightened of exposing him. This is what we must do! These scum are destroying the lives of our children by causing hardship for profit. Lying and embezzling entitlements to fill their bank accounts. The kind of perverts who went in to the proffession for money only. Weaklings who will do anything ACC tells them to. No character, moral fibre or ethics are there hallmarks.
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#3 User is offline   aphinity 

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Posted 21 September 2004 - 01:03 PM

Thanx for your feedback.

This guy is a "specialist" in diagnosing a back problem? NOT.
I want ACC to justify his qualifications that make them use his Expertise...if he has any. He seems to specialise in a totally different field.

I was amazed at how, with only seeing me for a short time, without giving me a decent oppourtunity to explain my pain symptoms, or seeing my xrays and MRI, this so called "doctor"was able to diagnose me with nothing wrong.
Each time I tried to say something, he would shake his head. Did not like it when I advised him I had started to see a chiropractor...screwed his face up and asked WHY???

My explanation was I was sick and tired of waiting around for tests, and wanted something done...so I was penalised for trying to help myself?? THIS SYSTEM of ACC is so bloody backward. At least I had a referral from the doc....hehehe.

I really don't want to earn a decent living, drive my car which I adore, but can't stand sitting in it now, dig my vege garden, ride my horse..play cricket...all the things I cannot do now. I must hate myself to dream up imaginery pain to disable myself from having a LIFE.

If I wasn't depressed before I saw him, I certainly was afterward...what baffles me though, is if this is in my head, why tell me to take more paracetamol...the light stuff that doesn't work to help my pain.

I am about to lose my car as its so hard now to find the money each month, let alone run the damm thing up and down to these assessments etc. Gone are my commissions, my bounses...my freedom and my bank balance.

Until people injure themselves, they have no idea what ACC is like...as I do now.

How can I go about finding other womem who have been through this assessors office? I would love to know how he made them feel, what he did. I hate to think what it would have been like if my boyfriend had not been there with me.

I have always been a person who feels for the underdog, hates injustice..and now I am one. What they don't realise, is I don't forget. What goes round comes round..I can't wait!!!
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#4 User is offline   doppelganger 

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Posted 21 September 2004 - 07:23 PM

I am sorry hat you had to go through what you did. If he was a good doctor he would have told what to do in helping to live with your condition. he has not helped with anything except to make it worse. By what you say is wrong with you your condition isn't too bad if looked after. there are heaps of sites that discribes back pain and what to do. there is information on this site that also

you should not need to go through any assessment by a assessor that is not qualified in the area of injury.

It is past time for you to get a proper assessment fron a person who is specialised in your injury. get your own GP to arrange a medical examination.

You and a lot of others will end up with out the proper treatment because you are relying on the honesty of these assessors to tell you the truth. Unfortunally they do not know what honesty is. the change in the Act is to cover ACC's Arse when one of these assessors make a mistake.
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#5 User is offline   Juscallin1 

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Posted 21 September 2004 - 07:48 PM

;) Hi. Please post his name up on the Board.
You can take his decision to Review. You have the right to demand further tests etc.
If you go to Review, you will need to have another Medical Assessment from a Specialist that your GP choses.
Feel for you, being treated in such a way. You can complain to ACC complaints, but probably a waste of time.
These so called Occupational Assessors are not Specialists. It is their "job" to say you can work at the selected jobs!!

ACC are just pushing the pain in your head theory.it is an easy way to exit you.
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#6 User is offline   grumpy 

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Posted 21 September 2004 - 09:23 PM

In my opinion - avoid ANTHONY ASTERIADIS!! he cannot be trusted.
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#7 User is offline   aphinity 

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Posted 22 September 2004 - 12:24 AM

In my opinion Dr David Ruttenberg does not make one feel comfortable
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#8 User is offline   Juscallin1 

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Posted 24 September 2004 - 09:07 AM

Hi Aphinity,
If it was Rottenberg that assessed you, you can take it to Review and win as he is NOT A QUALIFIED ASSESSOR. there is a strain on this site about him.

He is supposed to be working under supervision.
Good luck
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#9 User is offline   fairgo 

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Posted 24 September 2004 - 04:22 PM

My question is ... did your boyfriend witness the examination and 'interview'? If so ask him to write his version down. There are guidelines that 3rd party medical assessors have to follow set down by the medical council. They are also able to be 'looked at' by the Health and Disability Com. At a meeting I went to with him the com. said that whilst they can't loook at the reports that are written they CAN look at the doctors behaviour during the assessment if you consider it to have been in breach of the health and disability consumers code of rights. You can pick up the code form any GPs office or local hospital.
Behaviour such as you have indicated is NOT to be tolerated and MUST be reported.
This is aside from the fact that if your assessment was done by Ruttenburg it is flawed anyway as he is to be working under supervision. He is not QUALIFIED to carry out such assessments on his own.
hope this helps...
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#10 User is offline   greg 

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Posted 24 September 2004 - 08:56 PM

are these case managers so controlled that they choose no not
to apply the documented injuries/ degenerative etc., they are willing
to allow their personal identification to be exposed in the false belief
that their superior system, will go to support them. sorry me. me. me. me.
when you read this, it is to help with your future employement.
NOT ACC.
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#11 User is offline   aphinity 

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  Posted 01 October 2004 - 03:40 PM

Hi and thanx for all the responses. Quite hair raising to find out the things I am being told.

Not sure what to do...bit flustered and depressed.I feel so small in all this.
I am waiting for the report...but thinking about that...wasn't i meant to get a copy of the initial occupation assessment anyway? The report that goes to the medical assessor???

I was told I can work 2 hrs a day...doin what? I can't do my original job anymore.
Thank god for legalised prostitution, as I can't sit or stand for much at a time, guess I can lie down for 2 hrs eh?

I have had some offers of advice from some support groups and will be following up with them. My case manager and her assistant won't return my calls or emails to answer my queries, but quick to send out requests for ID and consent forms. What do they need my ID for? IRD, child support and other deps have never requested it.

Please bring it to our branch..yeah right..and what money do I use for gas to make the 80k return trip??? Do they compensate me for the fines I will get for driving my car unregistered and woffed coz I don't have enough dosh to get it done?

And they have threatened to stop my pay if I don't. Bloody hell, I am just getting over the stress of messy seperation and business finances, yet to have all this shite happening....when all I did was have a fall and hurt myself, now I feel I have to prove that I am for real. Tired of the whole thing. Tired of being in pain. Tired of living like this. Leave me alone to heal in peace ACC!!! I want to work... I want my life back..all this dicking around is not helping me to get up and about again. Tension does not reduce the severe muscle spasms and inflammation around my injury.

I guess I have joined the fishbowl life of ACC, cept the darned goldfish have a higher IQ the all of ACC put together.

Sorry for rambling, but I am so dammed angry. I will wait for my boyfriend to come home so I can take it out on him..thats what they want isn't it?

I get angrier the more I read on this site. How can ACC be so callous to people in need? It mystifies me... I had no idea of the crap that goes on, no idea of the activities they undertake to EXIT a claimant.
How many others are out there, that don't know that they are being treated unfairly? How many others have decided to end things because of the pain, loss of dignity, loss of income, loss of family, relationships, social life, independence, feeling of worth, happiness, TRUST, and the ability to have a normal existance????

THE BLOOD IS ON YOU ACC.

Thoughts go out to you all...
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#12 User is offline   doppelganger 

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Posted 01 October 2004 - 10:50 PM

Aphinity,

Your Assessments;
section 92 (3 ) informs the corporation that the claimant will be supplied with a copy of the report from the Occupational assessor amd section 96 (3) will supply you with a copy of the report from the medical assessor.

you are feeling angry, this is not supprised as the treatment of you by the corporation is trying tobring you down to there level.

If the corporation is not acceoting the tax number that you have given them then ask for your tax department to confirm that the tax number on this letter is yours.

the forms tat they are sending you fill them in and do not leave and blank places as if you do this the corporation may and often do fill these in for you. Make sure that you place on the form "This form is fulled in on request from the corporation in the letter dated ******** I have the right to alter and change these documents when and how I please"

this will make there own documents even more usless than before. return them by post using there Free Post 264 If you cant aford an envolope then use theirs.

They are playing a game with you. It is called 'harrassement' intimination is what they are doing. if your kidds did it a school it is called bulling. Some police Officers will take notice of it, you can only try. the corporation is doing it as a group. they are taking advantage of you in your condition.

Transport needs. If the Corporation wants you to go to any meeting request transport. your car doesn'thave a warrent so request that they supply a taxi if you are not in a physical condition to use a bus (if you have a bus service) Don't accept that they will refund the money as this really happens.

:D ;) :D :)
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#13 User is offline   hippy 

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Posted 26 November 2004 - 11:34 AM

I have completed the IOA and now have a date for the IMA. Should I have a copy of the IOA showing job descriptions etc. prior to being assessed by the Doctor so I know what i am being assessed for. thanks for your help............
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#14 User is offline   ernie 

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Posted 26 November 2004 - 11:59 AM

Yes, you definitely should.

They are required by law to give you a copy (section 92(3) IPRC Act), and it should be with sufficient notice before the medical assessment that you have time to prepare to tell the medical assessor all the reasons, both injury-related and otherwise, that would restrict you from doing the various jobs in the occupational assessment.
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#15 User is offline   hippy 

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Posted 30 November 2004 - 02:07 PM

3 days before my IMA and still no report from ACC regarding the IOA, what is "sufficent time" for me to prepare myself for this interigation, should I ask them to delay the appointment or should I just not turn up for it. I feel that they are playing cat and mouse with me. I did phone the CM last week for a copy of the report and he said ,with a laugh, that I would get it as soon as he did. I note my appointment is with an "Occupational Physician", is this the norm. Thanks.
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#16 User is offline   hippy 

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  Posted 02 December 2004 - 02:32 PM

Iv'e got one day before my IMA and still have not received a copy of the IOA findings.......should I cancel the Doctors Appointment ,phone my CM again for a copy of the report ( a bit late now), or just go along with it.??????
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#17 User is offline   flowers 

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Posted 02 December 2004 - 04:54 PM

They expect us to obey the rules and dot the i's and cross the t's but they can do as they please under the ageis of "policy" and leave it up to us to fight them in the courts. In this case I would email my case manager with copies to branch manager and all the exeutive at acc politely refusing to attend until the ioa is produced and suggesting that full disclosure is mandatory under the act and the ioa is needed so you can peruse it and get qualified advice from your medical and personal advisors sufficiently enough prior to the arsessment so as to enable you to fully participate in the arsessment and in the interests of creating an atmosphere of trust.
It will probably get you canned immediately but I believe you are in your rights in requesting full disclosure. It is your right and they are cheating so as to deliberately rush the thing through before you have information you are entitled to so as to make an informed decision.
If not get a lawyer and attend with a witness and taperecorder and request to see the data that has been supplied to the arsessor.
If refused refuse to proceede with the ima.
These bastards need to be brought to heel and made to obey the rules.
Do not let these curmudgeons cheat you as they surely will if you meekly let them snowball you.
If you do decide to attend as the potential hassles are too much at least have a witness and taperecorder they cannot refuse especially if you notify they before you attend by Email and phoning both the case manager and the doctor. This is mandatory for your protection and to assist in later appeals and court cases when or if needed.
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#18 User is offline   doppelganger 

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Posted 02 December 2004 - 08:06 PM

I disagree with some of the stuff flowers. I do agree with attending the meeting and asking to see what the ACC has provided. if no IOA assessment is there then the medical assessor can not proceed as there are no occupations to be assessed.

the medical assessor can only say that they can not complete an assessment with out the required information.

When the medical assessor asks if you can do that job or any job ask what are the specific tasks in that job. If you are unable to do certain things then ask if any of those tasks are in that job. if the medical assessor can not answer then you can not give an answer as you do not have all the information.

Your Occupational assessor does not take any disibility into consideration. this is something that I am oposed to as it means that the occupational assessor can randomally secelect jobs that you are unsuitable for and therefore require another assessment and costing more money.

the Acts says that the occupations must be suitable and available in NZ (section 91)

Take a taperecorder and a witness. If the assessor objects that you use a recorder then itis his bad luck. tell him that the recording is for your and his protection and it is known that the ACC do payin excess of $7,000.00 to assessors.

Good luck and take care
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#19 User is offline   flowers 

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Posted 03 December 2004 - 12:17 PM

You are dead wrong dop I'm sorry to say.
1. entering into wordgames with ACC hired minions will get you nowhere.
2. the med arsessor has to have the ioa so he can arsess if you are able to undertake the jobs outlined and I can see no good reason for not supplying the ioa reports in good enough time to be studied by the claiment and the only reason for this I can see is so that they can muddy up the waters and railroad the stock..
3 If more of us challenged the legality of ACC proceedures we would jam up the courts so seriously that The Government would be forced to have a very serious look at what their employees are actually doing and a hell of a lot more IFFY practices will be brought to light.
They in my opinion have withheld information deliberately and the reasons are highly suspect.
I may be stock but I will not kowtow to these pricks.
I also believe that they have convieniently forgotton to supply the ioa report in the hope that when you appeal the ima at a laterstage the time to appeal the ioa is expired.
ACC have shown by their actions that they are not to be trusted by their denial of rights the methods they use and their determination to rehabilitate us off their books by any means possible. Full disclosure is their enemy and they have consistently denied it to their targets . They are expert in circumventing the act with policy as is born out with the ammount of appeals they are losing in the district and high courts where the suspect decisions they make with these reprehensible tactics are reversed and brought to light. It would appear that.
They employ, at high salaries, the best lawyers, and others staff to achieve this Knowing that their victims do not in most cases have the financial or physical rescources to legitimately challenge their scurrilous practices.
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#20 User is offline   flowers 

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Posted 03 December 2004 - 12:28 PM

Furthermore why is it mandatory to have the ioa before the ima.?
The answer is plain as the nose on your face. It is so they do not have to supply the medical/pysical limitations of the assessee to the ioa assessor so he cannot take them into accountand provide an out for their toadies so the can say they cannot take into account the clients limitations in their assessments. Where is the honesty in this.
By this tactic alone they show they are liars by omission and onle out to get the results they want not what the claimant requires and is entitled to under the acts.
ACC should be dismantled with predudice and all the board thrown in the can and the key destroyed like they destroy all our records that do not support their pogrom repeat pogrom.
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