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Dr Ruttenberg assessments

#1 User is offline   lizzie 

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Posted 16 April 2011 - 04:53 PM

Hi
Our local branch of ACC in Tauranga have requested that we have an Occupational Medical Assessment with Dr Ruttenberg 7 weeks into a 12 week medical absence from work (GP certificate).

I know that this Dr has had significant scandal asociated with his assessments for ACC in the past. I am assuming that he is now fully qualified to do these assessments? Does anyone know?

Also are there any other occupational physicians that we can see that visit Tauranga? We don't trust our case manager or her suggestions/recommendations.
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#2 User is offline   greg 

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Posted 16 April 2011 - 05:52 PM

an IOA. is different from an Occupational Medical Assessment .
use these terms to chech via the search . top right of screen.
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#3 User is offline   lizzie 

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Posted 16 April 2011 - 06:41 PM

View Postgreg, on 16 April 2011 - 05:52 PM, said:

an IOA. is different from an Occupational Medical Assessment .
use these terms to chech via the search . top right of screen.


Sorry, I can't quite find a place on this forum for this question. Can you suggest where I might post this question that would be more appropriate?
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#4 User is offline   doppelganger 

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Posted 17 April 2011 - 12:18 PM

View Postgo joe, on 17 April 2011 - 09:39 AM, said:

He is good i had no trouble until the report came in then there where the mistakes so read what has been written down once its done ask questions of the man while you are there an IOA is that a IOA its not a lets see approach do it right the first time there is no second chance if you cant do something (job) make sure you explain (put it in writing before the you go to assessment) why you feel so and ask him to note that on his file and make sure the report is correct if not ask for it to be corrected he corrected mine with out a fault and i found him to be better than those others that they have. I had him as my VOMA and he toasted the other Dr's make sure any past history or injurys that you have had are mentioned EVERYTHING is taken into account but only if you tell him ACC wont mention it



I've added you put it in writing and yes there is a few things you can not put down.

You can't do the job when you can do some of the activities with some Vocational Rehabilitation.
The specialist have been trained to obtain certain information from experts. the object is not to obtain a report for the supply of up skilling or retraining as none can be supplied under legislation, so the report is a document saying no more Vocational Rehabilitation is needed.

You need a document done by you before the assessment and checked to see have not made common mistakes. One is can do that job when you could with aids, training and up skilling. I'm not saying yopu will work 30 or more hours but as a PI would look at it and say you could do 2 hours per day.

By providing a written document it prevents the assessor from making mistakes having the assessor write Claimants claims they can not do the job.

here is an example was prepared for some one else

it was effective in a known toadie in wrtitng a report which ACC did not progress further as rehabilitation would not increase earnings.

Quote

Job Summaries

91412 Loader and/or checker

Due to the injury, many of the duties in this occupation are working in all weather conditions, lifting and carrying are constant, repetitive movements are frequent, driving of forklifts and other equipment frequent and requires mental skills of organisation and practical. The PSTD has limited my thinking and organising skills making this occupational impossible to carry out.

41312 Dispatch and Receiving Clerk

The duties in this occupation require fine motor skill work for filling out dispatch notes, exposure to current weather conditions, constant standing, lifting and carrying constantly, driving of forklifts, use of minor office and hand tools and requires mental skills of organisation and practical. Working in cold weather affects the extremities as in the medical reports from specialists. This occupation is therefore impracticable.

41311 Stock Clerk

Stock Clerk duties include standing, lifting and carrying, repetitive arm hand and finger movements are constant, use of minor office tools are frequent and require mental skills of organisation and practical. The use of minor office tools is very limited as hands swell when in constant use. This is the known fact with my injury that there is a very limited time period that the hands can be used.

91411 Packer

Packer involves standing constantly, lifting and carrying, repetitive hand movements are common, cold conditions are common and requires mental skills of organisation. Repetitive hand movements cause severe aggravation and subsequently pain in hands as per medical reports therefore this occupation is out of my capability.

91514 General Labourer

General labourer is the position I held at ACC where my injury originated from. Labouring involves tasks of working outdoors (or cold) constant standing, heavy lifting carrying and pulling or pushing frequently, and repetitive movements frequently. As it was this former occupation that caused the injury, this type of occupation for me to participate in should be dismissed, as it will only aggravate my injury further.

91111 Cleaner

Cleaning duties involve gripping with the hands to sweep, scrub, and polishing floors. Outdoor work, standing constantly, light to medium lifting or pulling and repetitive movements are also a necessity of this occupation. Medical reports state gripping or repetitive motions aggravate my injury it is therefore applicable that this occupation is again outside of my capabilities and should be avoided so as to not aggravate my injury.


41443 General Clerk

General clerk includes duties of repetitive arm hand and finger movements on a constant basis, use of hand tools on a frequent basis and requires sound level of keyboarding, mental skills of organisation and practical. Again this occupation is out of my capabilities because of repetitiveness in the duties it is therefore impracticable that this occupation be recommended.


41444 Office Machine Operator

Machine operator has duties of loading of paper and insertion of stencils, standing frequently, lifting and carrying, use of minor office tools, carry out repairs and adjustments and requires mental skills of organisation and practical. Fine skills such as loading of machinery and use of minor office tools should be avoided as per medical reports. Standing is also an issue because pain from standing for periods dissabilitates me. My injury prevents me from carrying out many of the duties involved in this occupation and so therefore should be avoided.

41412 Record and Filing Clerk

Record and filing clerk is another occupation that has duties of operating binding and covering equipment, standing frequently, lifting and carrying, repetitive arm hand and finger movements, use of minor hand tools and requires mental skills of organisation and practical. Lifting and carrying should be avoided as these alone aggravate my injury.

33422 Teacher Aide

Teacher Aide is an occupation that I am very familiar with. I am unable to carry out many of the duties in this occupation as it involves standing frequently, lifting carrying and holding, repetitive movements with hands, use of tools and power tools and requires mental skills of organisation and practical. My PTSD diagnosis prevents me from mental skills and practicable skills. The lifting and repetitiveness of the duties also would be a factor on aggravation of my injury. As I am involved in this occupation at ACC I am able to recognise that many of the duties are outside of my capability and therefore this occupation is impossible for me to do on a full time basis.


31142 Computer Systems Technician

Computer system technician is what my social employment is currently classified as. Although this job is an excellent occupation it is still outside of my capabilities to do this over a prolonged period. Duties in this occupation include machine repair and maintenance, standing frequently, medium lifting, use of hand tools and power tools, repetitive movements on a frequent basis and requires mental skills of organisation and practical. My injury deteriorates with repetitiveness and lifting. The need for fine motor skills is also affected by my injury. Many of the duties are unable to be conducted by myself and frequently the use of students to contribute to the duties is the only thing that allows me to continue this social occupation at the school. It is therefore noted that this occupation is impracticable during the course of a full day.


83212 Light Truck or Van Driver

Light truck or van driver involves many duties that are outside of my capability. These include working in all weather conditions, lifting and carrying frequently, repetitive hand and arm movements on a frequent basis, driving frequently and requires mental skills of organisation and practical. It is noted in medical reports that my driving capability of around 2 to 3 hours in any day contributes to increased pain and swelling of the hands. It is also noted occupations that involve working in cold conditions need to be avoided; therefore this occupation is again not a viable option.

52111 Sales Assistant (Electronic and Related Goods)

Sales assistant is an occupation I am familiar with from when I was employed at the computer/video shop. Duties of writing invoices or dockets, standing frequently, lift and pass items, lifting pulling or carrying, repetitive hand and finger movements on a frequent basis, use of hand tools frequently and requires mental skills of organisation and practical. Handling of items such as money is unable to be pursued. Lack of fine motor skills and no sensory feeling in hands and repetitiveness prevents me from pursuing this occupation.


82922 Electric and Electronic Equipment Assembler

Electric and electronic equipment assembler includes duties of standing constantly, frequently on concrete floors, handling tools on a frequent basis, many tasks are repetitive, use of hand power and machine tools and requires mental skills of organisation and practical. As my injury involves sensory loss, electrical shocks and heat extremities are not detected until damage has been done. The repetitive movements in this occupation are also a factor that it aggravates my injury and causes pain and stiffness. This occupation need to be kept well clear of as it's potentially a life threatening situation for me to be engaged in.


Modified employment details to ACC as who there employer is not relevent to you.

You get one chance, do it right and you should not need to do it again, gain all of your entitlements awarded under legislation.
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#5 User is offline   lizzie 

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Posted 17 April 2011 - 12:47 PM

View Postdoppelganger, on 17 April 2011 - 12:18 PM, said:

I've added you put it in writing and yes there is a few things you can not put down.

You can't do the job when you can do some of the activities with some Vocational Rehabilitation.
The specialist have been trained to obtain certain information from experts. the object is not to obtain a report for the supply of up skilling or retraining as none can be supplied under legislation, so the report is a document saying no more Vocational Rehabilitation is needed.

You need a document done by you before the assessment and checked to see have not made common mistakes. One is can do that job when you could with aids, training and up skilling. I'm not saying yopu will work 30 or more hours but as a PI would look at it and say you could do 2 hours per day.

By providing a written document it prevents the assessor from making mistakes having the assessor write Claimants claims they can not do the job.

here is an example was prepared for some one else

it was effective in a known toadie in wrtitng a report which ACC did not progress further as rehabilitation would not increase earnings.



Modified employment details to ACC as who there employer is not relevent to you.

You get one chance, do it right and you should not need to do it again, gain all of your entitlements awarded under legislation.


So what you are saying is that it would be a good idea to provide Dr Ruttenberg with a summary of injury, treatment, and assessments and a job description summary with reasons as to why these cannot be carried out?

I am seeking info on behalf of a relative who does not have internet access :rolleyes: , but basically the situation is that he is a fisherman (part owner in business) who was sent back to work on limited duties (by ACC) but re-injured himself when he found repeatedly that he could not effectively do his job on these limited duties. ACC appointed occ therapist agrees with this but ACC don't and have requested Dr Ruttenberg's input. (Please excuse my lack of knowledge as to the correct lingo ;) ) Meanwhile he and his family have no income!
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#6 User is offline   Huggy 

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Posted 17 April 2011 - 12:56 PM

When the occupational assessment has been done the occupational assessor will provide a list of occupations that are within your qualifications or skills that you have acquired over the years.

Once I had the IOA in my possession I wrote the above comments for each job that the assessor had provided.

You can ask the assessor to provide job description sheets for every job they belive are withion the scope of your qualifications, look at these closely and write a description as Doppelganger has put up earlier.

When you go to the IMA the medical assessor is going to ask you about each job and if you believe there is anything that will prevent you from doing the jobs.

That is where the list that you created refferring to each job and why you believe you can or cant do the jobs. You can as I did provide the explanations as I did or alternatively read out each one as the assessor asks you about it.

It is actually quite good to prepare something like the above before you attend the IMA. WHat I have found on earlier occasions is if you are nervous or are being affected by stress or tiredeness from your injury when an assessor asks you questions you may forget or you dont provide all reasons to the assessor and this is where the assessor will find weak spots and more than likely say you can do that particular job.

In a nutshell it is better to be prepared before attending as when in attendance things slip past your memory when under pressure or stress.
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#7 User is offline   greg 

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Posted 17 April 2011 - 03:03 PM

An important point here is that an 'IOA' [independant occupational assessment]is pre-injury.
This does not need to included any injury restrictions [ARC.18] only requires any work experiences ,
they believe you done or maybe what you would like to try.
This is why claimants eg. with only one leg are assessed as dance instructors etc..
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#8 User is offline   fairgo 

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Posted 17 April 2011 - 05:47 PM

You need to be very clear about the process involved here. The first step will be an Initial Occupational Assessment - IOA, which will identify jobs the assessor believes you can do based on the person's previous skills and experience. From that will come a report - which you are entitled to have a copy of. The assessor MUST include your comments about jobs also so make sure they are included. When a copy of the IOA is sent make sure it includes all the relevant job sheets. Go through each job and identify what can and can't be done. Remembering of course that the work should be sustainable, in other words if there are aspects of the job that you might be able to do for limited time eg sitting then make sure that is mentioned in the report that you will write BEFORE attending the Initial Medical Assessment IMA. If an appointment has been made to see Ruttenberg then it is an IMA and all the stuff I have written above should already be familiar to you. I have also just realised this is on behalf of a relative so just interpret my explainations to relate to him rather than you :)
The thing about the IOA and IMA is that they are very specific assessments and they must be done in accordance with legislation. If you don't have a copy of the legislation - this can be found online http://www.legislati....html#dlm101437

You want to read Sections 89-96.
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#9 User is offline   doppelganger 

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Posted 17 April 2011 - 07:29 PM

The case manager may have thought it was an initial occupation assessment, but your explaination looks more like ACC may be modifying the work place so the person can do the relative work. being a fisherman will limit the type of work one can do on light duties and the type of modification to the work place.

One thing is do everything in writing as the communeration by phone visiting the office does not leave a paper trail.

Of cause if ACC hasn't modified the work place to the required level means ACC caused the injury to deteriorate and it is ACC responcability to pay for any modification and training which will not affect the liability of your levies.

Quote

Meanwhile he and his family have no income!



The assessment will be to remove all liability. He was on selected duties previously and there for would have had make up loss of earnings. were the ACC paying compensation so he could do just light duties.
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#10 User is offline   scared 

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Posted 18 April 2011 - 08:19 AM

If you go to the main page and search on Ruttenburg - you will find heaps of topics on him. I personally think IMHO he is an absolute toady. Think my hubby saw him at least 4 times. I do know that when Otto had an MRI done (which he didnt bother looking at before writing his report) Ruttenburg told my husband it was a waste of time for him to get an MRI and wanted to put a stop to it. He is very arrogant and only there for ACC. Welcome to the world of being a stock clerk :-(
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